For the Ladies: On Etiquette

[dlgood]

What is a gent to do?

Went in for my first session of physcial therapy today, as I have decided I must finally get off my ass and get my knees working properly again. (Apparently, I need a new wheel alignment...)

In any case, I spend most of the session seated up on a table, doing leg exercises off the side, while the Physcial Therapist observes and moniters my knee joint. Sitting below me on the stool.

Did I mention that the physical therapist is female?
Did I mention that she was wearing a v-necked sweater with no shirt?
Did I mention that she seems to have breasts the size of my head?

Okay - not really. She has proportional breasts, inasmuch as they are very big proportions. And because I am a gluttonous pig, I like big portions, when available.

I should be better than this. Looking at Cleavage = Looking at the sun and such.

I know this is rude, right? You just don't stare down a lady's shirt, no matter how hot she is. I try to be good. I try to be strong. And yet, I cannot look away.

I am so weak... Send help PLS

Comments

[librarian2003.livejournal.com]

*Chuckle*

Did you consider that she is a ministering angel who does it deliberately, to take the male mind off the excruciating pain that she is about to inflict during the PT session...?

Hope it does your knees good. Otherwise, at least it's doing something else good. :~)

Jo

[fb2wendy.livejournal.com]

I am laughing so much. Sorry. I've seen similar things happen in my line of work (health care, with "hands on" component - no pun intended). If it makes you feel any better, it's probably happened to the lady in question before, if she wears V-necked sweaters regularly.

Is there any advice I can suggest? I'm thinking probably not much. Other than the typical suggestion to visualise something different of an aversive nature or alternatively, close your eyes. If the temptation is great, then closing your eyes may be the only solution.

[graffitiandsara.livejournal.com]

It's hard to be stern when you've got me laughing this hard. Can you at least be subtle? If you can then it's probably not that terrible. Good luck with this! Try not to get yourself slapped.

[cleapet.livejournal.com]

Considering where she was sitting, she probably knows intimate details about your package. To which she applies professional objectivity, I'm sure. ;)

She is probably aware. I'm sure you're discreet, anyway.

[starryniteshade.livejournal.com]

You poor, poor boy! You are in a predicament for which you will just not get any sympathy. So, you'll just have to learn to suffer through it. ;)

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Dude, just don't... leer, you know?

Heh.

[carlyinrome.livejournal.com]

Before I say anything, I'd like to provide you with some background information, because we don't really know each other that well, and I don't want you to think I'm being . . . testy.

I've had DD's since eighth grade.

What you're doing to that poor woman? Happens to me. A lot. And has since, like, seventh grade.

That said: I'm finding it very difficult to feel sorry for you.

Now that that's out of the way: Why do you have to look? I don't understand. They don't belong to you. They're just breasts. You could find a point on the wall and look at it. Or look at your knee or something. Or find someone else exercising in the gym -- not a woman with an ill-fitting sports bra -- and watch them exercise. Or you could bring a book. Or maybe you could, gee, strike up a conversation with her about any number of things that aren't her mammary glands. Say your therapy or her job -- you already know what it is -- and that way you could be looking at her face.

Just a few suggestions. Forgive the snark; it comes from it being eight years since someone with a penis has looked me in the eye.

[carlyinrome.livejournal.com]

Really. Do forgive the snark.

And good luck. I hope your knee gets better.

[marenfic.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the much needed laugh.

Those of us with natural cleavage are aware that cleavage can be seen when we wear v-necks. I think as long as you're discreet you can enjoy the benefits and remember, if you leer, then she can make PT very tough on you. *G*

[marenfic.livejournal.com]

While also walking the fine line of not objectifying her of course-- she is a professional woman! (my guilt kicked in)

[ladyoneill.livejournal.com]

The feminist in me wants to scold you, but, y'know, it happens. Some people find breasts attractive; others find butts, faces, calves, whatever. We're made to attract the opposite sex. If we didn't, the human race would die out.

And I know plenty of women, myself included, who occasionatly ogle boy parts, too. (and some, also myself included, the girl parts *g*)

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

Forgive the snark

No offense taken. If I were not genuinely bothered by my behavior, I would not have admitted to it. A mature adult should do a better job of not staring down a shirt because that's disrespectful. My behavior merits testiness.

In actuality, I did have a conversation with her. I spent most of the session talking about my knees. Various descriptions of the discomfort. The specific injury. That I played softball with it... lots of stuff in all manner of minute detail, and many questions about the PT and exercise regemin, and also what to do to reduce risk of recurrence and such...

But inasmuch as I tried to do things other than look down her shirt... I did kept looking back. While I put this post out for laughs, I'm also aware that I'm a grown man failing to behave like one. And I'm not particularly proud for that.

Next week, I hope to comport myself better.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

Yes, I was going for laughter. I am trying to be subtle. I didn't get slapped, and didn't get shunted off to a new therapist, so clearly I haven't yet crossed the worst of lines... but also, I must clearly exert more willpower next time. Because whether or not she was embarassed by my behavior, I was.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

I was not discreet. Or at least, I didn't feel discreet.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

I know plenty of women, myself included, who occasionatly ogle boy parts, too.

That's true. I'm sure, however that there are better ways to do it...

Words of wisdom

[ludditerobot.livejournal.com]

I don't have any solution, but I certainly admire the problem. Ashleigh Brilliant.

[jade-okelani.livejournal.com]

Oh poor you. I do feel sorry for you, but only because you realize how terribly wrong you are.

Though I must say: in her line of work, I'm surprised she would be wearing v-neck sweaters that are cleavage showing-off when she knows the... positions she's likely to get in with patients. I've had big breasts since the dang things started growing, and when I know I'm going to be in an interesting position, I tend to go with something high collared, just to avoid any awkward situations.

My best advice is to find something else pleasing about her, i.e., does she have pretty eyes, and try to re-focus your attention there, where she's less likely to notice. And if that doesn't work, pick a focal spot in the office -- a picture, the jar of cottonballs, anything, and make yourself a pact that you will not look away from it until you think you can look at her w/out staring at her chest.

So long as you aren't *leering* (And as someone who's gotten both, there's a huge difference between staring and leering) she's probably more amused than upset by the whole situation. And if you honestly, really, and truly, cannot stop yourself, just talk about the big white elephant in the room, and say you feel terrible for staring, but you just. can't. help it. You're 80/20 that she takes it as a compliment and doesn't shunt you off to another PT. *g*

Good luck to you, sir.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

What a fitting icon...

Those of us with natural cleavage are aware that cleavage can be seen when we wear v-necks.

Am I paranoid, or do those of you then get together and make fun of those folks who make the biggest asses of themselves in the process of seeing said cleavage...

Re: Words of wisdom

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

"Looking at cleavage is like looking at the sun, you don't stare at it. It's too risky. You get a sense of it and then you look away."
-- George Costanza

[scribesds.livejournal.com]

While I put this post out for laughs, I'm also aware that I'm a grown man failing to behave like one. And I'm not particularly proud for that.

Sounds to me like you're acting *exactly* like a grown man! Don't fret yourself about it - you can be sure she knows what effect she has on men.

[marenfic.livejournal.com]

You're not paranoid.

:)

[crazywritinfool.livejournal.com]

You know... if she's wearing a V-neck and no shirt, and she's got the big bazoombas, you might as well look cause she's not working too hard to hide 'em. Apologies to Ms. DD down there, but c'mon. If you've had them all your life, you know how to minimize the "glare," so to speak.

Hell, I would have looked...

[anonymous_sibyl]

She does this for a living. She knows you're going to look. As long as you make more eye-to-eye than eye-to-breast contact, and provided you're not making the graspy hands while chanting "gazongas" you're good. *g*

[canadiangirl-86.livejournal.com]

Can't you, like, ask her out or something? *G*

[wisewoman.livejournal.com]

But there, you see? You're already contemplating the next time. She has achieved her aim, as any good physical therapist should, in guaranteeing that you will return time and again and put yourself through what amounts to pain and torture.

Do you really think she was unaware of the effect that sitting below your eye-level would have? I think not.

;o)

[mshepnj.livejournal.com]

Hee.

Oh Dave. It just means you're normal - and not blind. The novelty will surely wear off at some point and then you can focus on other...bits. Hee.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I'd sneak a look and hope she didn't notice.

[midnightsjane.livejournal.com]

*sporfle* As others have said, as long as you're not overly obvious and grossly rude about it, I wouldn't worry. Hey, I remember a guy I worked with who wore the tightest damn pants you ever saw..I couldn't help myself, my eyes were just drawn to his "nether region". It was impossible to look away..

[spectralbovine.livejournal.com]

Oh man. The eternal dilemma. I feel your pain, man.

God, I need to find myself a cleavage icon.

[chrisleeoctaves.livejournal.com]

You crack me up, Dave.
Were you drooling? Because that would have been rude, maybe, you know if some of the drool hit her shoe- but otherwise...Oh, maybe this isn't politically correct for me to say.
Never mind.
*g*

[hjcallipygian.livejournal.com]

I know how you feel. I'm in class for massage therapy, and I'm in the only male there. And after a month and a half of taking off clothing and getting up on tables and rearranging and such, the ladies are getting fairly cavalier about staying covered the whole time; if something pops out for a split second, well, a couple of them just don't much care. Apparently, I am just now "one of the girls," or something.

But it sounds to me like there's a big difference between you glancing down her cleavage and that guy who almost breaks his neck turning around to watch her breasts walk by.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

I promise to leer only if I immediately follow that up by tumbling off the table in a hilarious fashion.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

That's a fitting icon, if ever there was one...

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

I didn't quite pull the cartoon wolf thing or anything, if that's what you mean. But I wasn't exactly smooth...

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Bottom line is, noticing breasts and cleavage is only a problem if it prevents you from noticing there's a human being behind said breasts and treating her like a human being.

Otherwise, don't sweat it.

[chrisleeoctaves.livejournal.com]

I doubt *anyone* would have been smooth faced with, ahem, those things.

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

They are just breasts, though. It's not like I haven't seen breasts before... Perhaps, the problem is that I haven't seen these breasts before. Maybe that's it?

Actually, probably not.

[jheaton.livejournal.com]

Heh. This is a position I've found myself in on more than one occasion since taking the bookstore job, because ogling the goodies of one's female customers ≠ good customer service. I've become very good at maintaining eye contact in those situations, but in a weird way that seems almost as bad as ogling, because even though I'm not looking at the breasts, I'm pretty much exclusively thinking about them. I'm not sure what it means that I find myself feeling guilty about not staring at a woman's breasts, but it's probably not particularly healthy.